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Facts and footnotes...Part II
- To: babel-list
- Subject: Facts and footnotes...Part II
- From: "j.BOLt SThAR eNYCh" <eltyger>
- Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:33:51 -0500 (EST)
- Reply-To: babel-list
- Sender: owner-babel-list
0036 EST // Sat 31 Jan 98 // BklnNYC
BEGIN PART II
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>From: "Ed Ezergailis" <moriarty>
>To: <babel-list>
>Subject: Facts and footnotes for the lecturer
(much Patti content)
>Date: Fri, 30 Jan 1998 22:13:11 -0500
>... See PART I, ELSEWHERE
>> Patti was never a part of that, except in the
>> Media. Her Attitude was often a bit Punk-ish, but
>> Musically...Nah.
>
>Not speaking for Patti are you?
** Nope. My Point is that Patti Came Before Punk. And
had more in common - musically (IMO) - with the
*Nuggets* groups than what came to be called
"Punk" Groups.
** I Actually Believe that Patti Smith *Caused*
Punk Rock.
And that's because they Do have One Common Factor:
*Do It Yourself*
Patti's Overwhelming Achievement was to
*Demonstrate* that it is *Possible* to...
And She *Continues* to Do so.
"Radiant/ Blazing/ Unlike *Anyone* Else..."
That's the *True*
"Spirit of Patti Smith circa 1977..."
>Sounds pretty PUNK to me
** "...Her Attitude was often a bit Punk-ish..."
>> She Certainly did *Not* Dis-Avow the
>> Punks - She always cheered for Young Bands - but She
>> wasn't a "Punk". No More than were Blondie,
>> Talking Heads, Cramps,...
>
>Says you. Lux and Ivy have always called themselves punks
>(psychobilly punk rockers - but punks none the less) -
** Sez me. "Psychobilly" Yes - the term was invented
for them (perhaps by Lux?). "punks"? I don't think
so. They too were Playing by early 1975 - and moved
to LA circa 1978 because they didn't like the NYC
scene. You got any References?
Lux and Ivy are two of the *Best*
Performer/Songwriters - Then or Now.
(Whatever they Wore - or Didn't Wear.)
>And as for Blondie, re your earlier Legs McNeil reference:
>
>"Near the end of '75 PUNK magazine appeared. Editor
>John Holmstrom, and his living cartoon creature Legs McNeil,
>were two more maniacs running around town putting up signs
>that said 'Punk is coming! Punk is coming!'...
>...
>(from *Making Tracks*, by Harry, Stein, and Bockris
> - published 1982)
>Is that punk?
** Sure. Obviously. Nice Quote. But it seems to be
about Legs - not Blondie.
>So no, Patti didn't go around saying "I'm a punk rocker"
>(that was Sheena :)). But she was one. Punk is/was about
>attitude, not about media labels - or website labels either.
** "Punk" *Is* a Media label.
>Punk is about this:
>
>"Basically, I just wanted to inspire kids, get 'em off their
>ass, get 'em thinking, get 'em pissed off, as pissed off as I
>was. Get them to look around at what was going on, even in the
>simplest way. Just get them to ask a few questions"....."our
>credo was WAKE UP!" (the infamous Burroughs interview I'm sure
>you've heard of, I forget the year, its not important)
** Sure it is. It's a Great Quote. Here's the
Reference:
"talking with william s. burroughs"
[from "When Patti Rocked,"
by William S. Burroughs,
*Spin*, April 1988]
(The Interview actually took place Mar 79)
You can read the whole thing on babelogue
(see under "interviews")
http://www.oceanstar.com/patti/
>Didn't think I'd ever have to go back to school and put
>quotations after my statements...
** I Understand. But, see, there was a reason they
wanted You to learn all that stuff. It's Real
Important when You want to write long-winded
diatribes and have your readers be able to
distinguish Your own Stellar Opinions from those
other things which you've picked up here and there
- like Hearsay from Anonymous Sources...
>but just this one time JBolt I went and played your game.
>Now those list members who were undecided can decide.
** babelistas always decide.
>I don't feel a need to have to do this again.
** Certainly not. 'Specially if You're just going to
keep repeating yourself...
>The best data/info of course comes from real people like
>certain producers, struggling Detroit rock bands with lots of
>energy, concert promoters who might be personal friends with
>Patti and Lenny, a balding drummer, and god only knows who
>else. And of course I wouldn't have ever known anyone like
>that...
** If You Say So. In any event, if they're not
published, then it's just Hearsay - which is OK, if
so labeled - You Know: Journalism 101...
>so I just used published stuff up above. The kind of
>stuff you're usually dealing with yourself.
** Yeah. But I give the Reference(s).
>Don't worry, I'll try not to do it again so I'll be easier
>for you to dismiss casually.
** No Problem.
>Generally, like Patti, "I don't read rock publications and I
>haven't for years".
** See? No Reference. Are You making it up?
"Speaking for..."? Who Knows?
Thing is, Patti doesn't have to read them, She
Speaks to them. Then they Publish and (Some of Us)
can read them and be fairly sure that She really
said something like that.
With mr.ed's technique, one never knows...
>And finally, Re: Horses - "We were four misfits trying to
>connect with other people like us and give them a
>communications ground. We weren't after commercial success -
>just the opposite. Horses was an expression of the organic
>process of reaching people no one else was talking to."
>(Patti Smith, Now Magazine, July 5, 1995)
** Ya got me on that one. Haven't got it posted on
babelogue (yet). But it Sounds about right - I'll
take Your Word in this case.
>And that's for the gold record sales discussion too.
>
>Some of us still hate Pink Floyd,
** And Some don't waste energy "hating" Anyone...
>Ed
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