From babel-list-owner Mon Aug 1 06:38:44 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71DciS5028870 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 06:38:44 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j71DciE5028869 for babel-list-obscured; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 06:38:44 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from imo-m25.mx.aol.com (imo-m25.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.6]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71Dce6u028863 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 06:38:43 -0700 Received: from Lloyd5009 by imo-m25.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id m.7d.6e587052 (2168) for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 09:38:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Lloyd5009 Message-ID: <7d.6e587052.301f7fd8> Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 09:38:32 EDT Subject: Patti at Summer Stage in NY To: Babel-list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5200 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ I copied this from the SummerStage website - What I remember about either the '93 or the '95 show was it was really hot and Patti admonished the people who had brought their children. My toddler was at home so luckily I escaped her scolding. Lisa _Patti Smith Janet Hamill & Moving Star _ (http://www.summerstage.org/index1.aspx?BD=18242) Thursday, August 04, 2005 Beginning at 7:30 PM Central Park SummerStage Legendary punk priestess Patti Smith needs no introduction. Though this is only her third appearance at Rumsey Fieldbher first performance in 1993 was one of the highpoints of the festivalbs historybbut the poet and rocker is a SummerStage favorite and makes her third appearance having performed in 1993 and 1995... From babel-list-owner Mon Aug 1 07:21:03 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71EL1rO029926 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 07:21:03 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j71EL1GI029925 for babel-list-obscured; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 07:21:01 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from imo-m17.mx.aol.com (imo-m17.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.207]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71EL0aX029919 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 07:21:00 -0700 Received: from Bluemuse by imo-m17.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id m.146.49a0f06f (16111) for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 10:20:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from FWM-D27 (fwm-d27.webmail.aol.com [205.188.162.3]) by air-id12.mx.aol.com (v106.2) with ESMTP id MAILINID123-3eef42ee2fc63c; Mon, 01 Aug 2005 10:20:54 -0400 Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 10:20:54 -0400 Message-Id: <8C764BB5C7DE97C-E8C-AAFC> From: bluemuse References: <7d.6e587052.301f7fd8> Received: from 64.252.97.11 by FWM-D27.sysops.aol.com (205.188.162.3) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Mon, 01 Aug 2005 10:20:53 -0400 X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI X-MB-Message-Type: User In-Reply-To: <7d.6e587052.301f7fd8> X-Mailer: AOL WebMail 1.1.0.13360 Subject: Re: Patti at Summer Stage in NY Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 To: babel-list X-AOL-IP: 205.188.162.3 X-Spam-Flag: NO Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ It was the '93 show that was so hot; it had been 100 degrees for a couple of days, if I remember right, and we were sitting in those horrible plastic Samsonite chairs, the air not moving and everyone's collective breath hanging in the air. TC Boyle opened up. Summerstage for some reason doesn't acknowledge the September '96 show. I emailed them to let them know that this would be Patti's fourth appearance, but they say they have no record of that show, so it must not have happened. (It was not a free show, but a benefit for Summerstage IIRC; Patti managed to get the price down a bit, though.) --Bob Farace -----Original Message----- From: Lloyd5009 To: Babel-list Sent: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 09:38:32 EDT Subject: Patti at Summer Stage in NY I copied this from the SummerStage website - What I remember about either the '93 or the '95 show was it was really hot and Patti admonished the people who had brought their children. My toddler was at home so luckily I escaped her scolding. Lisa _Patti Smith Janet Hamill & Moving Star _ (http://www.summerstage.org/index1.aspx?BD=18242) Thursday, August 04, 2005 Beginning at 7:30 PM Central Park SummerStage Legendary punk priestess Patti Smith needs no introduction. Though this is only her third appearance at Rumsey Fieldbher first performance in 1993 was one of the highpoints of the festivalbs historybbut the poet and rocker is a SummerStage favorite and makes her third appearance having performed in 1993 and 1995... From babel-list-owner Mon Aug 1 07:37:23 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71EbNqN030310 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 07:37:23 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j71EbMim030309 for babel-list-obscured; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 07:37:22 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from services.cam.org (services.cam.org [198.73.180.252]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71EbLUF030302 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 07:37:21 -0700 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=localhost) by fenric.services.cam.org with esmtp (CAM Internet) id 1DzbPn-00015l-R3 for ; Mon, 01 Aug 2005 10:37:15 -0400 Received: from Toronto-HSE-ppp3756448.sympatico.ca (Toronto-HSE-ppp3756448.sympatico.ca [67.68.128.79]) by courrier.cam.org (IMP) with HTTP for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 10:37:15 -0400 Message-ID: <1122907035.42ee339b420bc> Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 10:37:15 -0400 From: lassido To: babel-list Subject: Bochum concert on TV References: <200508010900.j71902XF018486> In-Reply-To: <200508010900.j71902XF018486> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.2 X-WebMail-Company: CAM Internet X-WebMail-URL: http X-Originating-IP: 67.68.128.79 X-CAM-Spam-Score: skipped (trusted host) Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Hello, I received this message and was ask to post it: Great news: I find out that the Concert in Bochum will be Broadcast on the German/Austria/Swiss Channel 3SAT (a Culturchannel, her with the original german words): 3SAT Samstag, 20.8. / 22.00 Uhr / Patti Smith & Band Ervffnung der RuhrTriennale aus der Jahrhunderthalle Bochum Mit Patti Smith (Gesang), Lenny Kaye (Gitarre), Tony Shanahan (Bass) und Jay Dee Daugherty (Schlagzeug) Special guest: Tom Verlaine Fernsehregie: Hannes Rossacher Muttergottes der Punkpoesie, Hohenpriesterin der alternativen Szene, Schamanin des Punkrock: Patti Smith schrieb als kompromisslose und radikale K|nstlerin Musikgeschichte. Ihre Auftritte sind spirituell hochkonzentrierte Rock-'n'-Roll-Messen. Bekannt wurde die Sdngerin, Songwriterin, Poetin und K|nstlerin mit ihrer Begleitband in den 1970er Jahren. The Patti Smith Group spielte 1975 die Schallplatte Horses ein, inzwischen ein Klassiker der Rockmusik. Mit ihrer musikalischen und poetischen Intensitdt und Kreativitdt blieb Smith stets unberechenbar und |berraschend. Extreme sind ihr Markenzeichen. Zu den prdgenden Figuren ihres Werkes gehvren William Blake, Arthur Rimbaud, Georges Bataille, Robert Mapplethorpe, William S. Burroughs, Jean Genet. In Bochum gibt Patti Smith ihr einziges Deutschlandkonzert in diesem Jahr. In der Besetzung mit Lenny Kaye an der Gitarre, Tony Shanahan am Bass und Jay Dee Daugherty als Drummer ervffnet Patti Smith die diesjdhrige RuhrTriennale, eines der ambitioniertesten und aufwdndigsten Theater- und Musik-Festivals in Europa. In der Festivalreihe Century of Song spielt sie mit Special Guest Tom Verlaine. Den Sdnger und Gitarristen der New Yorker Punkband Television kennt sie aus ihren Tagen in der New Yorker Underground-Bar CBGB, wo ihre Karriere begann. Neben ihren eigenen St|cken wird Patti Smith auch Lieder von REM, Brecht, Hendrix, Nirvana, Dylan, Television und Smokey Robinson singen. From babel-list-owner Mon Aug 1 07:49:15 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71En8d9030624 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 07:49:14 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j71En7hD030620 for babel-list-obscured; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 07:49:07 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from Front-end1.KRONOS.COM (front-end1.kronos.com [158.228.2.31]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71En1YM030595 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 07:49:05 -0700 Received: from exchg-f.KRONOS.COM ([158.228.0.199]) by Front-end1.KRONOS.COM with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Mon, 1 Aug 2005 10:48:49 -0400 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: RE: Patti at Summer Stage in NY Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 10:48:49 -0400 Message-ID: Thread-Topic: Patti at Summer Stage in NY Thread-Index: AcWWpHm19Qq+khhnRAGYqPjDM9Cs7QAA3jEg From: "Gart, Mitchell" To: , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Aug 2005 14:48:49.0839 (UTC) FILETIME=[20C523F0:01C596A8] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by penguin.postmodern.com id j71En6YM030610 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Yep, that's right. A bunch of babel-list people met after the 96 show at the bar next to the Chelsea Hotel. - Mitch > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-babel-list > [mailto:owner-babel-list]On Behalf Of bluemuse > Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 10:21 AM > To: babel-list > Subject: Re: Patti at Summer Stage in NY > > > It was the '93 show that was so hot; it had been 100 degrees for a > couple of days, if I remember right, and we were sitting in those > horrible plastic Samsonite chairs, the air not moving and everyone's > collective breath hanging in the air. TC Boyle opened up. > > Summerstage for some reason doesn't acknowledge the September > '96 show. > I emailed them to let them know that this would be Patti's fourth > appearance, but they say they have no record of that show, so it must > not have happened. (It was not a free show, but a benefit for > Summerstage IIRC; Patti managed to get the price down a bit, though.) > > --Bob Farace > > -----Original Message----- > From: Lloyd5009 > To: Babel-list > Sent: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 09:38:32 EDT > Subject: Patti at Summer Stage in NY > > I copied this from the SummerStage website - > What I remember about either the '93 or the '95 show was it > was really > hot > and Patti admonished the people who had brought their children. My > toddler > was at home so luckily I escaped her scolding. > Lisa > > _Patti Smith > Janet Hamill & Moving Star _ > (http://www.summerstage.org/index1.aspx?BD=18242) Thursday, August > 04, 2005 > Beginning at 7:30 PM > Central Park SummerStage > Legendary punk priestess Patti Smith needs no introduction. Though > this is > only her third appearance at Rumsey Fieldbher first performance in > 1993 was > one of the highpoints of the festivalbs historybbut the poet and > rocker > is a > SummerStage favorite and makes her third appearance having performed > in 1993 > and 1995... From babel-list-owner Mon Aug 1 08:21:33 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71FLWPc031356 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:21:32 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j71FLWGS031355 for babel-list-obscured; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:21:32 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from sccrmhc11.comcast.net (sccrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.202.55]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71FLUYg031348 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:21:31 -0700 Received: from hppav (c-67-183-11-251.hsd1.wa.comcast.net[67.183.11.251]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc11) with SMTP id <2005080115212401100i37qre>; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 15:21:25 +0000 Message-ID: <004f01c596ac$e4481e00$fb0bb743> From: "PageRox" To: , Subject: Re: [eternalcafe] come on Andi - BUST EM! Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:22:54 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Aw hell, it doesn't bother me one bit. I think its interesting, even if it isn't true. ANY competent astrologer on this list can do Patti's chart and see how it compares--I'll bet there's lots of members here who already have! As to corporate whoring, this is the VERY least of it, I'd rather concentrate my energies on things like booting out this administration and charging them with war crimes and treason. THERE'S your corporate greed. XO-Glenna ----- Original Message ----- From: Dennis Moore To: eternalcafe ; babel-list Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2005 8:01 AM Subject: [eternalcafe] come on Andi - BUST EM! I think a commercial site behaving this way is pretty smarmy....the more I think about it - the madder I am. You see, their creation of that sample horoscope did exactly what they intended, that is, to get posted to lists/groups for free advertising and/or to get people to their website - on the backs of the artists and photographers. I know it is common, and in many cases access to some of the best information/content on the Internet, for us to provide 'heads-up' to different sites (not to mention clipping text) to the Patti list[s]. I am certainly as much at fault in this regard as the next person; however, after this I am going to be more conscientious about it from now on. I will TRY NOT TO REWARD BAD CORPORATE BEHAVIOR. (What individuals do [not for any remuneration or profit] is, although legally no different, a different set of conditions to consider, and, with regards to this point, is a different discussion. Always, Dennis RPP = respect Patti please SPONSORED LINKS Patti smith ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "eternalcafe" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: eternalcafe-unsubscribe c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.7/60 - Release Date: 7/28/2005 From babel-list-owner Mon Aug 1 08:27:05 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71FR3vF031486 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:27:05 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j71FR3Uu031485 for babel-list-obscured; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:27:03 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from sccrmhc14.comcast.net (sccrmhc14.comcast.net [204.127.202.59]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71FR1iu031476 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:27:02 -0700 Received: from hppav (c-67-183-11-251.hsd1.wa.comcast.net[67.183.11.251]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc14) with SMTP id <2005080115264601400jectpe>; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 15:26:56 +0000 Message-ID: <005c01c596ad$a955ac80$fb0bb743> From: "PageRox" To: , Subject: Re: [eternalcafe] RE: astro.com - redux: online copyright myths OR Possunt quia posse videntur (NPC) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:28:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Thanks, Dennis--I know I already answered this, but I wanted to say that this is a good guide for those who seek to use images, etc, on their sites, blogs, etc--but what about just dling an image for private use? Is that governed by the same laws? I mean, dling a Patti pic to look at or have as a desktop wallpaper? I hope not! I've not got a website, and I am smart enough to know about posting someone elses' pix anywhere, but I do thank you for this as my teenage son needs to know these laws! He has no website, but belongs to many posting groups that use avatars. I've fwded your message to him so he'll know just what NOT to do! XO-Glenna ----- Original Message ----- From: Dennis Moore To: babel-list ; Eternalcafe 7 Online Copyright Myths By Judith Kallos Possunt quia posse videntur ~ (Latin: They can because they think they can.) One of the most misunderstood issues online has to do with copyright. Both with e-mail and Web site copyright issues. For some reason, as with many things online, there is this incorrect perception that anything goes. However, many are finding out the hard way that when it comes to protecting creative collateral, copyright is law. And, copyright laws can and are being enforced online. No, I am not an attorney. Nor do I play one on T.V. But I can help you avoid potential problems based on guiding clients for over a decade. Hopefully, this effort will help others from finding out the hard way that copyright is alive and well online. 1) "I can right click, save anything online and use it how I wish." This is a perfect example of just because you can doesn't mean you do! Those graphics or files were created by someone out there. They legally attained the copyright upon that file's creation. Without their specific permission to use that file or graphic, you have no right to just take it and use it as you please. Always ask a site owner before you illegally swipe anything off their site. 2) "As long as I note the author's name, I can use their site's content on my site." Although you are being nice and giving credit where credit is due, you still need to ask the author's permission to post their work on your site. The author may not want their information posted anywhere off their own site or they many not approve of your site as a venue for their information - that is their choice to make not yours. Always ask a site owner if you can use their content before you put it on your site. 3) "I can link to graphics on other sites so that they display on my site." O.K., maybe you didn't actually download the graphic and put it on your server, but if you are displaying someone else's work on your site without their permission the bottom line is still the same. And, you are using their server's resources to display something on your site. Shame on you! 4) "I can display pages from other's Web sites within frames on my site." Many site owners prohibit their site pages from being framed within another site because it gives the impression that the other site created the information. Many times folks innocently do this so they don't have to send site visitors off their site for information they want to provide. Others do so to precisely give the impression it is content they created. A better option is to link to the information you like and create a new window to open when doing so to ensure your site is still available to your site visitors. 5) "If I only quote a portion of another site's content and link to them I do not need their permission." Again, it would behoove you to have permission to do so. Using only portions allows you to possibly give the wrong impression about the author's overall content and this can be misleading at best. If you want to quote any written work in whole or part you need to ask permission to do so. 6) "If I pay someone to create graphics for my Web site, I own the copyright to those graphics." Not necessarily. Unless your agreement with the graphic artist explicitly states that upon your payment all of their rights are then transferred to you, you most likely only have exclusive license to use those graphics. And to purchase the full copyright will cost you a bunch more than simple exclusivity! Understand that the moment anything is created whether it be written or drawn, the creator owns the copyright, -that's the law. Over the years I've had clients claim they own copyright just because they paid me to create this or that. It simply, legally, is not the case (and my contract(s) clearly state this - including their option to purchase my copyright if they so choose). Copyright can only be transferred in a written legally binding agreement signed by the creator of the work stating they are transferring their rights to you. Saying you own it because you paid for it doesn't make it legal fact. If you do not have a written agreement specifically transferring the copyright to you, you do not own the copyright to those graphics. 7) "E-mail is not copyright protected once it is sent." E-mail is a written work that once created is copyright protected by the author. This means you cannot post publicly an e-mail sent to you privately. You cannot post private e-mails to your site, to message boards or to your blog without the author's specific permission to do so. Just because an e-mail was sent to you as a private communication does not mean you then own it and can do with it what you like. In addition, e-mail that is posted to a group of people, on a mailing list or Newsgroup does not make the e-mail available for reposting, copying, or any other use - not without the express and written consent of the writer. What's the bottom line with online copyright? Courtesy! Don't assume that you can use, repost or take anything you find online simply because you can. Be a courteous Netizen and always ask first! You might be interested to find a DMCA (Digital Millennium Copyright Act) page and policy statement on your ISP and hosting provider's Web sites to handle complaints and reports of the above types of copyright abuse. Take some time to read that information and make yourself aware of your rights and make sure you do not infringe on others. The main resource for all the legal mumbo jumbo on online copyright and the DMCA is on the Government's site at http://www.copyright.gov . Again, I am not an attorney nor am I providing legal advice. I hope I've informed you of some of the issues that need to be seriously considered by all who are online whether they are creating their own or using others creative or written works. ================================================================ Judith Kallos is an authoritative and good-humored Technology Muse. Check out her new book: "Because Netiquette Matters! Your Comprehensive Reference Guide to E-mail Etiquette and Proper Technology Use" at: http://www.BecauseNetiquetteMatters.com ================================================================ Copyright C 2004 Jayde Online, Inc. All Rights Reserved. SiteProNews is a registered service mark of Jayde Online, Inc. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "eternalcafe" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: eternalcafe-unsubscribe c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.7/60 - Release Date: 7/28/2005 From babel-list-owner Mon Aug 1 08:30:08 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71FU88N031606 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:30:08 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j71FU80o031605 for babel-list-obscured; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:30:08 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from sccrmhc12.comcast.net (sccrmhc12.comcast.net [204.127.202.56]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71FU6YW031600 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:30:07 -0700 Received: from hppav (c-67-183-11-251.hsd1.wa.comcast.net[67.183.11.251]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc12) with SMTP id <20050801153000012006gg68e>; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 15:30:01 +0000 Message-ID: <006901c596ae$1798e860$fb0bb743> From: "PageRox" To: , Subject: Re: [eternalcafe] RE: The Killers redux: me bad Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:31:28 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ OK I was totally wrong about being lukewarm about the Killers---I ADORE one of their songs--can't remember the title but its just out now. My 10yo loves it too--and of course knows all the words! Apple doesn't fall too far from the tree in this case! That boy can hear a song once and memorise half the lyrics, hear it twice and its 'on the hard-drive' so to speak! I heard it the other day and was transfixed. I don't think its this song--its the very newest out from that lp. So--I'm recanting anything I may have said about this dapper quartet! (Or is it a quintet?--I should bone up on my Killers' knowledge!) XO-Glenna ----- Original Message ----- From: Dennis Moore To: babel-list ; eternalcafe Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:07 PM Subject: [eternalcafe] RE: The Killers redux: me bad Their Grammy Nominations: "Somebody Told Me" - Best Rock Song, Best Rock Performance by duo or group with vocal HOT FUSS - Best Rock Album > -----Original Message----- > The Killers Nominated For 4 MTV Video Music Awards For "Mr. Brightside" - > Best Group Video, Best Rock Video, Best New Artist in a Video, and Best > Art Direction in a Video. From their debut CD: HOT FUSS > > And > > June 14, 2005 > VOTE NOW for The Killers as People's Choice for Best International Artist > at the 2005 MMVAs (Much Music Video Awards) SPONSORED LINKS Patti smith ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "eternalcafe" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: eternalcafe-unsubscribe c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.5/58 - Release Date: 7/25/2005 From babel-list-owner Mon Aug 1 08:32:23 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71FWNfI031690 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:32:23 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j71FWNvZ031689 for babel-list-obscured; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:32:23 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from sccrmhc14.comcast.net (sccrmhc14.comcast.net [204.127.202.59]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71FWLxe031682 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:32:22 -0700 Received: from hppav (c-67-183-11-251.hsd1.wa.comcast.net[67.183.11.251]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc14) with SMTP id <2005080115321801400jji1ie>; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 15:32:18 +0000 Message-ID: <007a01c596ae$695ff760$fb0bb743> From: "PageRox" To: , Subject: Re: [eternalcafe] The Killers : redux - MTV MUSIC AWARDS Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 08:33:47 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Ah! It IS a quartet! I am vindicated a bit in my knowledge of the group, even though I've seen/read about them numerous times in RS and its ugly counterpart, SPIN, which I get for some reason unknown to me. And.....they're cute, too! ;-) XO-Glenna ----- Original Message ----- From: Dennis Moore To: babel-list ; eternalcafe Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 10:53 AM Subject: [eternalcafe] The Killers : redux - MTV MUSIC AWARDS The Killers Nominated For 4 MTV Video Music Awards For "Mr. Brightside" - Best Group Video, Best Rock Video, Best New Artist in a Video, and Best Art Direction in a Video. From their debut CD: HOT FUSS And June 14, 2005 VOTE NOW for The Killers as People's Choice for Best International Artist at the 2005 MMVAs (Much Music Video Awards)(http://www.islandrecords.com/thekillers/site/thekillers_news.las) GOOD LUCK GUYS! Brandon Flowers - Vocals, keyboards David Keuning - Guitars Mark Stoermer - Bass Ronnie Vannucci - Drums ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "eternalcafe" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: eternalcafe-unsubscribe c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.5/58 - Release Date: 7/25/2005 From babel-list-owner Mon Aug 1 10:39:16 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71HdF5h002833 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 10:39:16 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j71HdEsU002832 for babel-list-obscured; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 10:39:14 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from web50705.mail.yahoo.com (web50705.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.38.103]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with SMTP id j71Hd6r1002776 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 10:39:12 -0700 Received: (qmail 12113 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Aug 2005 17:39:03 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=hDQh0n2tKvUl1n7Nk6UxyxTbv1aF2rUUZ8V3nmGHdu+W+NIdNCnfgKAaP8S9mHGdcHAFwACFSwdJjfLulCnjLdiDupc8R8OSWwRNT0Vyvb3t6EFXVocgKDH8QmrCZ+QqfalV8ZemNbCjypR7xVNpkBCWsSjlJOjoGbDqTW0yBXI= ; Message-ID: <20050801173903.12111.qmail> Received: from [63.240.122.145] by web50705.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 01 Aug 2005 10:39:03 PDT Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 10:39:03 -0700 (PDT) From: B Kaye Subject: Re: Patti at Summer Stage in NY To: babel-list In-Reply-To: <8C764BB5C7DE97C-E8C-AAFC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ I just happen to be on business in Westport CT on Thursday Night and would like to get to this show. Can anyone recommend the best way to get in from Westport CT? I have a car but would rather not drive all the way in. thanks --- bluemuse wrote: > It was the '93 show that was so hot; it had been 100 > degrees for a > couple of days, if I remember right, and we were > sitting in those > horrible plastic Samsonite chairs, the air not > moving and everyone's > collective breath hanging in the air. TC Boyle > opened up. > > Summerstage for some reason doesn't acknowledge the > September '96 show. > I emailed them to let them know that this would be > Patti's fourth > appearance, but they say they have no record of that > show, so it must > not have happened. (It was not a free show, but a > benefit for > Summerstage IIRC; Patti managed to get the price > down a bit, though.) > > --Bob Farace > > -----Original Message----- > From: Lloyd5009 > To: Babel-list > Sent: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 09:38:32 EDT > Subject: Patti at Summer Stage in NY > > I copied this from the SummerStage website - > What I remember about either the '93 or the '95 show > was it was really > hot > and Patti admonished the people who had brought > their children. My > toddler > was at home so luckily I escaped her scolding. > Lisa > > _Patti Smith > Janet Hamill & Moving Star _ > (http://www.summerstage.org/index1.aspx?BD=18242) > Thursday, August > 04, 2005 > Beginning at 7:30 PM > Central Park SummerStage > Legendary punk priestess Patti Smith needs no > introduction. Though > this is > only her third appearance at Rumsey Fieldbher > first performance in > 1993 was > one of the highpoints of the festivalbs > historybbut the poet and > rocker > is a > SummerStage favorite and makes her third appearance > having performed > in 1993 > and 1995... > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From babel-list-owner Mon Aug 1 11:01:31 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71I1U3C003420 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 11:01:31 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j71I1UgQ003419 for babel-list-obscured; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 11:01:30 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from zproxy.gmail.com (zproxy.gmail.com [64.233.162.200]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71I1SGQ003411 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 11:01:29 -0700 Received: by zproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so722990nzk for ; Mon, 01 Aug 2005 11:01:22 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=YFk5ThaHlf/fA1ShcWtTf31tOm9g+4bHaxw4ZCbqA+kQgJPaJ4zXUAaiSOkKZTwoBWPbMCGAo/ZHU6XiQ51ht6yJEDS8OPLn16Wz1mvWOybkaAw977HOsLiD2LRKuNQKmc05FmmuEwZT05jEHAHLWCf8yVWgz09cCH6cJwLcdUw= Received: by 10.36.90.6 with SMTP id n6mr4629139nzb; Mon, 01 Aug 2005 11:01:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.36.105.8 with HTTP; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 11:01:22 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 19:01:22 +0100 From: Andrew F Wilson Reply-To: Andrew F Wilson To: babel-list Subject: Patti in Bayreuth Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by penguin.postmodern.com id j71I1TGQ003415 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Patti is attending the Wagner Festival in Bayreuth, Germany, at the moment. Apparently she is writing about her experience in the German newspaper Die Zeit. Here are some webpages which reference this: http://www.laut.de/vorlaut/news/2005/08/01/12828/ http://www.proradionet.de/prn/?s=newsarchiv&rubrik=starnews&newsid=5946 http://www.linternaute.com/actualite/depeche/30/77663/l_ex-punk_patti_smith_reporter_au_festival_de_bayreuth.shtml http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,1564,1665093,00.html Not much detail in any of these, I'm afraid. I think I'll walk over to the newsagent and see if I can get a copy of Die Zeit... kind regards Andrew From babel-list-owner Mon Aug 1 11:00:36 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71I0ZO5003397 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 11:00:36 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j71I0Zqn003395 for babel-list-obscured; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 11:00:35 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j71I0VBS003388 for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 11:00:33 -0700 Received: from Bluemuse by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id m.110.4ec4a38d (3866) for ; Mon, 1 Aug 2005 14:00:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Bluemuse Message-ID: <110.4ec4a38d.301fbd39> Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 14:00:25 EDT Subject: Re: Patti at Summer Stage in NY To: babel-list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: 9.0 SE for Windows sub 5016 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ In a message dated 8/1/05 1:40:47 PM Eastern Daylight Time, phtp88 writes: I just happen to be on business in Westport CT on Thursday Night and would like to get to this show. Can anyone recommend the best way to get in from Westport CT? I have a car but would rather not drive all the way in. You can take Metro North into Grand Central from Westport. From there, you have your choice of mass transit. I believe there's a subway stop right across from the 72nd street entrance to the park. --Bob Farace From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 08:44:19 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72FiIlp002835 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:44:19 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72FiI3u002834 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:44:18 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72FiCqA002828 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:44:16 -0700 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=Iu9/MGd3CvKXDNbQZzzTUKUfzURUnU9X6wkXAGq2dbybbot1KhZxz81xo0X0uWqu; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.32.93.112] (helo=dennis) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1Dzyw5-0004PM-5D; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 11:44:09 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Dennis Moore" To: , "Babel List" Subject: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:42:12 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcWUcstsKKbv+T+lT4qJKiV5R1RynADBJ8cw In-Reply-To: <198.43cfbca5.301bdb8a> Message-ID: X-ELNK-Trace: 5bcb83257d183b67dcbcc662d868a8a77e972de0d01da940d44fafe23b0d626360897b9599eae558350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.32.93.112 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by penguin.postmodern.com id j72FiHqA002829 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ I am certainly not versed in law, let alone a lawyer, however I have become pretty familiar with the copyright law, fair use and using the Internet and email. Here is what I understand about copyright with regard to the information I relayed, since a few people have been asking. Some background: I am part of the group responsible for founding and operating the James Purdy Society. As an author, Jamess bread-and-butter relies on those statutes, and the industry that depends on them as well. It was imperative in all we do to respect the law in order to respect him. Also, I got two shots over the bow as we began. One came from the Hemingway Society folks who tried vigorously to discourage us from starting a society for a living author. Although I knew we would be potentially facing a hostile estate if the family swooped in after James dies, it was a reality check to hear their horror stories and about all the litigation and legal troubles they had to face. The other had to do with a symposium that was planned by the New School University that some of our board members were involved with. Even though everyone involved was certain they were acting with impunity  claiming fair use  James shut it down. (The reasons arent pertinent here.) But through it all I did make sure I understood the section[s] of the law regarding fair use. First about websites (including blogs): regardless of whether they are privately or commercially owned, it doesnt matter, there is no such thing as fair-use, since it is a publicly accessible medium. If this isnt obvious to you, try and get permission from people. Believe me, it is much harder than you might think - even for an organization founded and operated primarily as an educational resource/institution - precisely because it is so accessible, and then so easily copied and used by another party. Often you cant locate the owner. More often, you will never hear back from them, and if you do, most likely they will want money, typically for a limited-time use, and seldom will they want full-text made available. Permission to use photographs has been even more difficult, not to mention original art. In any case it takes a lot of time to get just a little. Bottom line: without the express permission of the copyright holder, your use is not legal. Thus if the copyright owner contacts anyone to remove the material, they have no recourse but to comply or face penalties (depending on the situation, intent and use, extent of the violation, whether plagiary is involved, how the use is advertised/promoted, and whether remuneration or profit is involved. Indeed, Jenny Lens reported from her experience: That happens to my photos ALL the time. If I like the site, I send photos to replace it. if they are really large and won't answer me, I get their provider to remove the page (I did it for a runaways site full of photos from other photographers). Trouble is, it takes a full time effort to track down my pix, and the worst are books, CD, DVDs cos they make money off my photos!! Secondly, regarding email distribution* (see example disclaimer below): Our e-news is sent through email via a list of people [members] who have expressed a prior interest in receiving educational information per the founding mission of the not-for-profit educational institution. To archive the e-news on our website we will have to redact all copyrighted material for which we did not have express documented permission to use. (Note: each specific use must be authorized, that is for any time/place it is to appear.) At any time However permission of use can be withdrawn at any time by a simple written notice. The disclaimer also notifies the person receiving the information that he/she is not allowed to distribute/ publicly/relay the material [privately]. So what about my infraction? I cut-n-pasted 7 Online Copyright Myths by Judith Kallos from SiteProNews.com and posted it to the babel-list and the eternal-cafi. I violated the copyright of Judith and Site Pro, twice. Okay, lets say the case can be made for babelogue that it is an all-volunteer organization, operated on in-kind donations, which does not receive money from anyone for the service they provide, and which for the point here, is deemed an educational institution. Then perhaps my relaying something copyrighted relating to Patti Smith would not be a violation. However, once it is on the archive it is not protected as fair use. Furthermore, especially since I know it will end-up on the web site, I am likely responsible for a violation. In either case, if the copyright owner contacts babelogue requesting the post, or portion thereof, be removed, it would have to be. Otherwise there could be further action, such as having the site shut down. The same thing applies to any of the material on babelogue. However, since the babel-community has not formally organized as an educational institution/organization, and I also know that  I imagine under the strict interpretation of the law I have committed a violation regardless. Similarly, the owner of the babelogue site is not protected by fair use statutes. After Seena told us about the astro-site, had I sent her the article - that would have been perfectly legal. Not if I blogged it though, that would constitute publication and all the same rules apply as you learn in college for papers, especially as to be submitted for publication. So what about the eternal-cafi? Well Im sure yahoo has a butt-load of lawyers devoted to these issues, so intuitively Im certain they would have no fair-use protections. Every email has corporate crap (although less so than before) in its body, one. They accept advertisements, sponsor companies, etc. I dont even suppose if you make your group private you escape this reality. Im not sure about the groups archive, or not, but I am very conscious of these issues with regard to the groups I moderate/own on msn. My intuition also tells me that yahoo, etc. have pretty much figured out how to protect themselves from what individuals do using their site  but only to a degree. After all, we all remember the napster story. Bottom line to remain ethical and principled one will need to be very conscientious in cyberspace. Also she/he needs to be prepared to spend a lot of time and energy for little return to use copyrighted material to any significant degree, say on his/her web site. Each person is also responsible to the degree he/she is going to respect the _intent_ of the law, since many of the hairs have yet to be split in this arena. Unless she/he is a lawyer versed in intellectual copyright law, Im certain it would be too difficult to navigate the specifics of the statues and legal precedence, other than just always to figure on the side of caution  and respect. ) August 2005. Copyright by Dennis Moore. All rights reserved. [Note: Even without my making this explicit, as original material this article is protected by copyright laws. I could provide [public] permission of use here as well, stating that reproduction was allowed.] * Disclaimer [example]: This [James Purdy Society] e-newsletter may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not always been specifically authorized by the copyright owner. All material is being made available to advance the knowledge and understanding of the life, work and influence of James Purdy. We believe this constitutes fair use of any such copyrighted material as provided for in Section 107 of the U.S. Copyright Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C., Section 107, the material in this publication is distributed, without remuneration or profit, to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes. If you wish to use copyrighted material from this publication for purposes of your own which go beyond fair use, you must obtain permission from the copyright owner. From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 08:59:45 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72Fxi9l003277 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:59:45 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72FxiI0003276 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:59:44 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from [10.0.1.5] (dsl-dynamic-209-50-30-97.inebraska.com [209.50.30.97]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72FxeQT003264 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 08:59:43 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v733) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: From: "Michael C. Berch" Subject: Re: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:59:44 -0500 To: babel-list X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.733) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by penguin.postmodern.com id j72FxhQT003268 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ On Aug 2, 2005, at 10:42 AM, Dennis Moore wrote: > The other had to do with a symposium that was planned by the New > School > University that some of our board members were involved with. Even > though > everyone involved was certain they were acting with impunity  > claiming > fair use  James shut it down. (The reasons arent pertinent here.) WTF was *that* about? I think I'd lose quite a bit of respect for any author who shut down a symposium on the subject of his own work. I know some literary types can be difficult to work with, but that's sort of a new low. -- Michael C. Berch mcb From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 09:37:29 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72GbTb2004275 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:37:29 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72GbSD3004274 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:37:28 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72GbNvU004261; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:37:25 -0700 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=geNPqQtC77AgCzl50GAiEdZuQ2tA7T9H1ncQtWfT+CL7hUzfD7z8ER56OIJKW/cK; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.32.93.112] (helo=dennis) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1Dzzla-00039y-Fa; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 12:37:22 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Dennis Moore" To: "'Michael C. Berch'" , Subject: RE: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:35:29 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcWXezN0+MS7LcgDTI+yA+TEDhL1uwAA5y7A In-Reply-To: Message-ID: X-ELNK-Trace: 5bcb83257d183b67dcbcc662d868a8a77e972de0d01da940f5da4d12e600893ac250ffdaaefacbe3350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.32.93.112 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by penguin.postmodern.com id j72GbQvU004265 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ > WTF was *that* about? Actually, it was reportedly the way the people involved preceded, which included not asking the author in advance for his permission, consent about anything, let alone for his participation. Also, it ended up expanding to performances, etc., which they publicly advertised, and for which there was to be remuneration. It was at that point his agents sent them a cease and desist. James told me he felt like he was treated as if he was already dead. I did my best to stay out of the whole mess. I felt extremely bad for all involved, in particular Nic Burns - who I have developed tremendous respect for myself. It was not a high point....and sad. It could have been magnificent! > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-babel-list [mailto:owner-babel- > list] On Behalf Of Michael C. Berch > Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 9:00 AM > To: babel-list > Subject: Re: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] > > On Aug 2, 2005, at 10:42 AM, Dennis Moore wrote: > > The other had to do with a symposium that was planned by the New > > School > > University that some of our board members were involved with. Even > > though > > everyone involved was certain they were acting with impunity  > > claiming > > fair use  James shut it down. (The reasons arent pertinent here.) > I think I'd lose quite a bit of respect for > any author who shut down a symposium on the subject of his own work. > I know some literary types can be difficult to work with, but that's > sort of a new low. > > -- > Michael C. Berch > mcb From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 09:49:29 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72GnRhq004679 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:49:29 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72GnQ1q004678 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:49:26 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72GnJ1Q004660; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:49:22 -0700 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=g1rMXfX7w7OnUAy0hhVa44mygYCOAe5aB9iOrBWDgeAOsWiLvimj5cmyDl77h9re; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.32.93.112] (helo=dennis) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1Dzzx4-0003XH-T4; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 12:49:15 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Dennis Moore" To: "'Michael C. Berch'" , Subject: RE: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:47:26 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcWXezN0+MS7LcgDTI+yA+TEDhL1uwAA5y7AAACEkGA= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: X-ELNK-Trace: 5bcb83257d183b67dcbcc662d868a8a77e972de0d01da940bc894afdb58f1c1813563e18df350b8a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.32.93.112 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ > Also, it ended up expanding to > performances, etc., which they publicly advertised, and for which there > was > to be remuneration. It was at that point his agents sent them a cease and > desist. They had clearly gone beyond any fair use of material at that point. Fortunately the cease and desist did come sooner than later. Legally any conference, etc. even if protected as fair-use can be stopped by an author if they are using his/her work without permission in a reading, performance, or such, provided the written notice is received 24 hours prior to the event. From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 10:31:20 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72HVKQG006171 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:31:20 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72HVKMR006170 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:31:20 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72HVHMd006164 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:31:19 -0700 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=W1vME9z6A0O+f+j14JDbJGsoe5OB56qVXrVV5arSqV4BHheD13TzQ8+4h0nGECGM; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.32.93.112] (helo=dennis) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1E00bm-00030B-CE; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 13:31:18 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Dennis Moore" To: "'PageRox'" , , "'Eternalcafe'" Subject: RE: redux: online copyright myths - blogs (NPC) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:29:29 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcWWL2o9vM2fvHL5SMOP3oZg+/EczQBVCLpg In-Reply-To: <00a401c5962f$a0384a00$fb0bb743> Message-ID: X-ELNK-Trace: 5bcb83257d183b67dcbcc662d868a8a77e972de0d01da940c10526280c6daf2847f762c635b223c2350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.32.93.112 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ >> 5) "If I only quote a portion of another site's content and link >> to them I do not need their permission." [a myth] > Dennis, does this refer to posting on websites or blogs or does it include > emailing links with a description?? If so, we're all in alot of > trouble!!!! - XO-Glenna Increasingly blogs are being used as professional tools and/or as part of someone's resume, say to get established as an expert in such and such a field. Such professional 'gain' is not legally different from the actual exchange of money - those doing so would be well advised to proceed thoughtfully, and by all means to be damn sure they aren't plagiarizing. Best practice would be to ask to provide even just a link [on a web page for example], unless you are using the URL as part of your citation following standard publication guidelines. Many university web sites have good sections on guidelines, conventions and rules; as I recall, Columbia's is fairly extensive. In practice, take articles from the New York Times as an example. You will see links, with varying degree of text from the article; often it is no problem to find the full article several places. (It may even look 'proper' as it is in the format distributed to the private user by the Times.) But you try to get permission from The Times to even provide the link. Even though our website is on Wright State University's website, run by a professor in their English department, we have yet to get permission for any of the dozen or so requests we have made, even for archived review's, for example, regardless as to whether they are available on The Time's web site or not. Think about it. What interest does The Times have in someone not going [first] to them directly for the material/information, photo, whatever - for any topic or subject. Conversely, why would, say Columbia University, care if I gave a link to their publication guidelines web page? You might be surprised. Even with the original author's permission for an interview in an out-of-print Columbia University Press edition, they wanted $200 to use only a portion of the piece for only 12 months, even with all attribution, and meeting other conditions of use, of course. From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 10:58:49 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72HwmS7006907 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:58:48 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72HwmZi006906 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:58:48 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72HwlCF006901 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:58:47 -0700 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=ZfHM6urJ+UUkaineUP5+L6r4JH1BRsAouHGHxXaCKIsWldSORNuk/j6IIIXHjA8A; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.32.93.112] (helo=dennis) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1E012P-0007Xf-Ep; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 13:58:49 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Dennis Moore" To: "'PageRox'" , , "'Eternalcafe'" Subject: RE: Possunt quia posse videntur - redux (NPC) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 10:57:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcWWL2o9vM2fvHL5SMOP3oZg+/EczQBWZQRw In-Reply-To: <00a401c5962f$a0384a00$fb0bb743> Message-ID: X-ELNK-Trace: 5bcb83257d183b67dcbcc662d868a8a77e972de0d01da9407c52b4004ea87b9133e04f84f0f00a3c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.32.93.112 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Gleena posited "...does it include emailing links with a description?? If so, we're all in alot of trouble!!!!" Again, I'm as bad as anyone and would [previously] not hesitate to provide the community of information I thought was valuable, of interest, whatever, and Patti relevant. To repeat, because I don't want my main point to get lost, what I will be more conscientious of is where that link takes someone/comes from and how that party is behaving. Astro.com was a particularly manipulative, insidious and extensive violation, and not of just Patti's intellectual property. I'm not saying whoever was responsible is not "into Patti." Maybe they were "wanting to share" what they had done even. Ultimately it became traffic for the site. It will involve splitting hairs for the future. Perhaps I will talk about things more generally and assume the reader is intelligent to find "it" on his or her own if I provide enough key words, say, with my referencing to something. Perhaps I'll post less of that sort of message. Always, Dennis Now my brain hurts - I will be thinking about how this impacts my feelings and behavior with respect to file-sharing, bootlegs, etc. "Mmmmmmm.... (in my best Marge voice) From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 11:06:58 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72I6wnf007124 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 11:06:58 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72I6wnC007123 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 11:06:58 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72I6vEL007116 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 11:06:57 -0700 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=MLADOlrEcFO6vrSYZBvPEJUiAhBGfZX0iMjzgNDTyPbXqS6WUR9mFJf2znPCw+z+; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.32.93.112] (helo=dennis) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1E01AH-0005lM-4Y; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 14:06:57 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Dennis Moore" To: "'PageRox'" , , "'Eternalcafe'" Subject: RE: Possunt quia posse videntur - last word from me (NPC) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 11:05:12 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcWWL2o9vM2fvHL5SMOP3oZg+/EczQBWZQRwAADM8eAAABIIsA== Message-ID: X-ELNK-Trace: 5bcb83257d183b67dcbcc662d868a8a77e972de0d01da9400a6d8a6f27b67aea2e0fbf73596cec69350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.32.93.112 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Okay, I lied: Doubt it matters? Try busting yourself using google - tz ez. From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 11:04:24 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72I4NFi007030 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 11:04:24 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72I4NPB007029 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 11:04:23 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72I4JJb007021 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 11:04:22 -0700 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=TtxsHR7bmlB29Gb7Wm7WQO7nah+KslkEoyHWApqLntgoMmUfHKsInayQO3XZUPKp; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.32.93.112] (helo=dennis) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1E017h-0003rg-22; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 14:04:17 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Dennis Moore" To: "'PageRox'" , , "'Eternalcafe'" Subject: RE: Possunt quia posse videntur - last word from me (NPC) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 11:02:30 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcWWL2o9vM2fvHL5SMOP3oZg+/EczQBWZQRwAADM8eA= Message-ID: X-ELNK-Trace: 5bcb83257d183b67dcbcc662d868a8a77e972de0d01da940dc64d030ea4992d32191bfb43b65c8be350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.32.93.112 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ > Gleena posited "...does it include emailing links with a description?? If > so, we're all in alot of trouble!!!!" You are your content, darling. From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 14:01:51 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72L1pml011836 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 14:01:51 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72L1pDi011835 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 14:01:51 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from [10.59.1.143] (rrcs-24-123-96-174.central.biz.rr.com [24.123.96.174]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72L1mOC011812; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 14:01:49 -0700 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v733) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <1C69B306-4B8A-4FAA-9D95-FCEEE7016E9D> Cc: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Michael C. Berch" Subject: Re: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 16:01:45 -0500 To: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.733) Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ On Aug 2, 2005, at 11:47 AM, Dennis Moore wrote: >> Also, it ended up expanding to >> performances, etc., which they publicly advertised, and for which >> there >> was to be remuneration. It was at that point his agents sent them >> a cease and >> desist. > > They had clearly gone beyond any fair use of material at that point. > Fortunately the cease and desist did come sooner than later. > Legally any > conference, etc. even if protected as fair-use can be stopped by an > author > if they are using his/her work without permission in a reading, > performance, > or such, provided the written notice is received 24 hours prior to the > event. I'm not familiar with that particular provision of law (and, among other things, I'm a media and IP attorney). What is your source of information for that, and what exactly does it apply to? Is it related to public-performance rights? -- Michael C. Berch mcb From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 15:02:03 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72M22dr013077 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:02:03 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72M22ZL013076 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:02:02 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72M20ZS013071 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:02:01 -0700 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=TiQBxs/HdxcUUzFoFaagFcKjFlOreGEMI0K6BCylcr1oElmqFj+EuOC7R8438cJ9; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:Message-ID:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.32.93.112] (helo=dennis) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1E04pm-00057V-A2 for babel-list; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 18:02:02 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Dennis Moore" To: "Babel List" Subject: FW: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:00:19 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcWXpWdlzpQ+gAFkR2+uvZUghyVWygABSQ4wAAC0RbA= Message-ID: X-ELNK-Trace: 5bcb83257d183b67dcbcc662d868a8a77e972de0d01da940c2fe3ff7655b1df70ea17545e9827c43350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.32.93.112 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ > -----Original Message----- > From: Dennis Moore [mailto:clayboy56] > Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 2:56 PM > To: 'Michael C. Berch' > Subject: RE: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] > > Dear Michael: > > Yes, related to public-performance rights (but I'm not sure, and don't > recall, if strictly limited to those cases) - in a non-classroom setting. > As I recall, it is a rather short explicit subsection in Section 107 of > Title 17 that mentions the written notice. > > Again, I am not versed in law and could very well be wrong, but what I > wrote about is my understanding of the Section. If I am mistaken please do > clear up any misinformation. > > I certainly do remember being quite taken aback of how limited fair use > protections are, and how limited what is determined as fair use can be > applied to. I also learned that academics often operate as if protected by > some magic shield, and/or claim they know the law - and don't, at least to > the letter. > > Intent does play a huge factor in any determination as to what would > constitute fair use, but as you know ignorance of the law doesn't excuse > one either. > > Thanks, > Dennis > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-babel-list [mailto:owner-babel- > > list] On Behalf Of Michael C. Berch > > Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 2:02 PM > > To: clayboy56 > > Cc: babel-list > > Subject: Re: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] > > > > On Aug 2, 2005, at 11:47 AM, Dennis Moore wrote: > > >> Also, it ended up expanding to > > >> performances, etc., which they publicly advertised, and for which > > >> there > > >> was to be remuneration. It was at that point his agents sent them > > >> a cease and > > >> desist. > > > > > > They had clearly gone beyond any fair use of material at that point. > > > Fortunately the cease and desist did come sooner than later. > > > Legally any > > > conference, etc. even if protected as fair-use can be stopped by an > > > author > > > if they are using his/her work without permission in a reading, > > > performance, > > > or such, provided the written notice is received 24 hours prior to the > > > event. > > > > I'm not familiar with that particular provision of law (and, among > > other things, I'm a media and IP attorney). What is your source of > > information for that, and what exactly does it apply to? Is it > > related to public-performance rights? > > > > -- > > Michael C. Berch > > mcb From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 15:19:00 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72MIx9l013448 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:18:59 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72MIx8t013447 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:18:59 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72MIw4O013442 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:18:58 -0700 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=Qbp8jQI6jsERkQ8sGo0uEBWmDaj5kuVnbywl/TrShBgChaPfMrzaZQR7Fn0pRGvw; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.32.93.112] (helo=dennis) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1E056B-0000eC-AQ; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 18:18:59 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Dennis Moore" To: , "Babel List" Subject: RE: [eternalcafe] Thank you so much! Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:17:08 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcWXlQY1DL0PWl8xS3KiOmRSX8Xc3AAGo8yw In-Reply-To: Message-ID: X-ELNK-Trace: 5bcb83257d183b67dcbcc662d868a8a77e972de0d01da9406939e99bca56a68a67c94af154a96921350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.32.93.112 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by penguin.postmodern.com id j72MIw4O013443 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Natalie: I was not making any statement regarding astrology, but then I got to thinking...how do you know whoever did actually know Patti's time of birth? I went to look at the site again to investigate - and lo and behold the page seems to have been taken down.... Cheers, Dennis ________________________________________ From: eternalcafe [mailto:eternalcafe] On Behalf Of inxacoletti Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 12:05 PM To: eternalcafe Subject: [eternalcafe] Thank you so much! Poems, just looking through the posts to catch up on my favorite lady and I find this link for Astrology! Awesome. I love Astrology and have been silently praying someone would know her time of birth. Her moon is in Pisces like me, she is a beautiful dreamer and astounding poet that can make you feel exactly what she is feeling. I didnt even read the Astro. on her yet, just glanced at her chart. She has lots of Sagg.in her chart, she is a freedom ringer, a truth sayer and good friend, she has Leo, the fiery lover of the heart, and Scorpio!! what a power house of emotion!! I LOVE HER, and always will. I dont care what others think about how I view Patti, knowing her Astrological chart is comforting and reassuring for me. She really is the Lady I thought she was and I feel even closer knowing we share some of the same attributes. Im no snob and will never look my nose down on any one for their beliefs, so I hope everyone will respect each other for following their hearts when it comes to spiritual matters. This site is for people tp share their love for and about Patti, no one should be put off or made to feel second class. Truth, love and compassion. I have studied Astrology a bit,growing up in the 70s, grooved on Patti and searched my soul for love. I found it. peace, Natalie SPONSORED LINKS Patti smith ________________________________________ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS  Visit your group "eternalcafe" on the web.  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: eternalcafe-unsubscribe  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ________________________________________ From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 15:14:18 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72MEIL3013365 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:14:18 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72MEHUH013364 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:14:17 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72MECEB013356 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:14:16 -0700 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=ipI01L9vIv8M0O2YX6RS+aB9YE/sVwlN//zwSWq0sNwvWMd2Jp/mpdqsce9SD94S; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.32.93.112] (helo=dennis) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1E051X-0005hQ-7P for babel-list; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 18:14:11 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Dennis Moore" To: "Babel List" Subject: RE: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. - some links [NPC] Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:12:15 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcWXpWdlzpQ+gAFkR2+uvZUghyVWygABSQ4wAAC0RbAAAGk4cA== In-Reply-To: Message-ID: X-ELNK-Trace: 5bcb83257d183b67dcbcc662d868a8a77e972de0d01da9401e228ff49504ccbce2cc1425d702ac9d350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.32.93.112 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ http://www.utsystem.edu/ogc/intellectualproperty/copypol2.htm http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/index.html http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap1.html#107 From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 15:49:12 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72MnCL4014228 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:49:12 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72MnCZV014227 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:49:12 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net (smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72Mn7US014216; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:49:08 -0700 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=oFyzAhQfykfUj9Saj4S0ghXcLWvC+6I/dynxLl0cnfqx2AhYOLHtVpj6hCwZ8fLR; h=Received:Reply-To:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:Thread-Index:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [71.32.93.112] (helo=dennis) by smtpauth09.mail.atl.earthlink.net with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1E05ZL-0003ki-6Y; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 18:49:07 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Dennis Moore" To: "'Michael C. Berch'" , Subject: RE: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 15:47:20 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcWXezN0+MS7LcgDTI+yA+TEDhL1uwANtxqA In-Reply-To: Message-ID: X-ELNK-Trace: 5bcb83257d183b67dcbcc662d868a8a77e972de0d01da94024ea358daef0c3f4b0fd3ac58ffc326c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 71.32.93.112 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by penguin.postmodern.com id j72Mn8US014218 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Michael Berch wrote: > WTF was *that* about? I think I'd lose quite a bit of respect for > any author who shut down a symposium on the subject of his own work. > I know some literary types can be difficult to work with, but that's > sort of a new low. As an attorney, I doubt Michael is so naove to not realize that [often time] people have their own agenda and/or interests in mind. Rhetorical question: would you suggest an author [or artist] must simply concede when they suspect her or his work and cache' are being co-opted? Dennis From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 16:07:42 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72N7fZw014717 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 16:07:42 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72N7fPr014716 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 16:07:41 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.183]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72N7cuV014710 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 16:07:39 -0700 Received: from host81-158-17-119.range81-158.btcentralplus.com [81.158.17.119] (helo=plc) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKwpI-1E05rF2dqa-00079m; Wed, 03 Aug 2005 01:07:37 +0200 Subject: Fwd: Re: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] References: <1C69B306-4B8A-4FAA-9D95-FCEEE7016E9D> Message-ID: To: "babel-list" Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 00:07:39 +0100 From: "Words 2 - Permuted" Organization: Everything is Permuted Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Opera M2/8.02 (Win32, build 7680) X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse login:57deaf623c5ebec18d80bb77a7429aae Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 22:01:45 +0100, Michael C. Berch permuted the following: > On Aug 2, 2005, at 11:47 AM, Dennis Moore wrote: >>> Also, it ended up expanding to >>> performances, etc., which they publicly advertised, and for which there >>> was to be remuneration. It was at that point his agents sent them a >>> cease and >>> desist. >> >> They had clearly gone beyond any fair use of material at that point. >> Fortunately the cease and desist did come sooner than later. Legally any >> conference, etc. even if protected as fair-use can be stopped by an >> author >> if they are using his/her work without permission in a reading, >> performance, >> or such, provided the written notice is received 24 hours prior to the >> event. > > I'm not familiar with that particular provision of law (and, among other > things, I'm a media and IP attorney). What is your source of information > for that, and what exactly does it apply to? Is it related to > public-performance rights? > I think it must be (performiance rights). When I was working in publishing the rights we obtained prevented usage in performance (ok, the authors I had tended to be writer/performers so that had a *particular* point to observe); but the principle runs to plays, poems, extracts from novels etc. (Apologies for a couple of inadvertent off-list posts earlier tonight). The email package I'm using picks up the sender rather than the reply-to address....) -- Words Everything is Permuted http://www.permuted.org.uk http://my.opera.com/Words/journal/ http://www.permuted.org.uk/picofday.html - a daily photograph From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 16:06:27 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72N6Rq9014669 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 16:06:27 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j72N6RtY014668 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 16:06:27 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.186]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j72N6PVU014663 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 16:06:26 -0700 Received: from host81-158-17-119.range81-158.btcentralplus.com [81.158.17.119] (helo=plc) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0ML2Dk-1E05q33pRs-0000bw; Wed, 03 Aug 2005 01:06:23 +0200 Subject: Fwd: Re: RPP redux: copyrights and the Internet, cont. [NPC] References: Message-ID: To: "babel-list" From: "Words 2 - Permuted" Organization: Everything is Permuted Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 00:06:25 +0100 In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Opera M2/8.02 (Win32, build 7680) X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse login:57deaf623c5ebec18d80bb77a7429aae Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 17:47:26 +0100, Dennis Moore permuted the following: >> Also, it ended up expanding to >> performances, etc., which they publicly advertised, and for which there >> was >> to be remuneration. It was at that point his agents sent them a cease >> and >> desist. > > They had clearly gone beyond any fair use of material at that point. > Fortunately the cease and desist did come sooner than later. Legally any > conference, etc. even if protected as fair-use can be stopped by an > author > if they are using his/her work without permission in a reading, > performance, > or such, provided the written notice is received 24 hours prior to the > event. That sounds about right to me. A performance is a performance and therefore a copyright owner can prevent it going ahead. -- Words Everything is Permuted http://www.permuted.org.uk http://my.opera.com/Words/journal/ http://www.permuted.org.uk/picofday.html - a daily photograph From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 17:49:41 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j730ndTI017008 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 17:49:41 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j730ndgK017007 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 17:49:39 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from pop-siberian.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-siberian.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.71]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j730ncxs017002 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 17:49:38 -0700 Received: from wamui-hound.atl.sa.earthlink.net ([209.86.224.34]) by pop-siberian.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #10) id 1E07S0-0000xJ-00 for babel-list; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 20:49:40 -0400 Message-ID: <3606759.1123030180073.JavaMail.root> Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 20:49:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Keith Reply-To: Keith To: babel-list Subject: Patti mention in Rolling Stone magazine Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Earthlink Zoo Mail 1.0 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Hey in the latest Rolling Stone magazine, the one with Jimi Hendrix on the cover there's a mention of Patti winning Commander of the Order of the Arts award in France. I looked at www.rollingstone.com but couldn't find a reference for those of you who don't get the mag. It's in Random Notes on page 38. There's a pix of Patti with the award and giving a salute. The text is as follows: Patti's Prize. France decided to make an exception to its policy of hating every American: Patti Smith! For her work as a rad poet rocker, Smith was made a Commander of the Order of Arts. "I have vowed to live up to this honor in my work and my conduct," she said. In exchange, Smith will include an Edith Plaf song on her upcoming covers album, along with Bob Dylan and Dead tunes. Keith From babel-list-owner Tue Aug 2 19:45:32 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j732jW0I019716 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 19:45:32 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j732jWUp019715 for babel-list-obscured; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 19:45:32 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from web81508.mail.yahoo.com (web81508.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.37.111]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with SMTP id j732jUf6019710 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2005 19:45:31 -0700 Received: (qmail 71351 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Aug 2005 02:45:24 -0000 Message-ID: <20050803024524.71349.qmail> Received: from [67.39.187.222] by web81508.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 02 Aug 2005 19:45:24 PDT Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 19:45:24 -0700 (PDT) From: John MacDougall Subject: Summer stage - MC5 To: babel-list In-Reply-To: <200508020900.j72900sW025481> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ A nice review of the MC5/Sun Ra set at Summerstage. Wonder if anyone recorded it! Kinda wonder how Patti feels about the MC5 survivors after they blocked the MC5 movie that she was a supporter of. John 1960's Musical Anarchists Still Kicking Out the Jams By JON PARELES Published: August 1, 2005 NYTimes The MC5 and the Sun Ra Arkestra knew exactly what they meant by freedom when they shared a bill and performed together at Central Park Summerstage on Saturday afternoon. Freedom was about taking a known structure - a blues, a vamp, a swing tune - and overloading it with noise and wild impulses. When the two bands first played together, in the 1960's, they represented a shared utopian anarchy: MC5 mingled revolution, lust and the urge to rock, while the Arkestra tossed together African-inspired drumming, carnival pageantry, big-band arrangements and visions of outer space as a better place. The MC5 included a Sun Ra tune, "Starship," on their first album, "Kick Out the Jams." What both groups played, then and now, was also good-time music, from a time when protest and pleasure merged. The MC5, who formed in Detroit in 1966, used garage-rock, soul and blues-rock as the makings of rowdy psychedelic stomps. They denounced the war in Vietnam; they got primal about sex. In the ferment of the late 60's, the distorted momentum of the music was greeted as an insurrectionary force in songs like "Motor City Is Burning." It was also a foundation for metal and punk-rock to come. Two of the five original band members - the singer Rob Tyner and the guitarist Fred Smith - died in the 1990's, and Michael Davis (bass), Wayne Kramer (guitar) and Dennis Thompson (drums) haven't tried to recreate the original band. Instead, they call themselves DKT/MC5 and work with various singers. At Summerstage they had Mark Arm from Mudhoney, Handsome Dick Manitoba from the Dictators and Lisa Kekaula from Basement Jaxx, each offering a version of the old Detroit rebel howl. Gilbey Clarke, from Guns N' Roses, added a second guitar. There was also a two-man horn section. Heard now, the MC5's music showed its blues and soul roots. But it also reached psychedelic heights, particularly when Mr. Kramer took off on lead-guitar solos that stretched blues lines and Chuck Berry licks toward high-speed runs and distortion, while the rhythm section kicked harder and harder. The Sun Ra Arkestra, now led by the saxophonist Marshall Allen, is a gleefully overstuffed big band. Its members perform in glittering costumes and hats that are anything but uniform. Multiple percussionists pile onto swing beats, cluttering them with hints of Africa and Brazil. While members of the saxophone or brass sections play arranged passages, other instruments squeal and bark and cackle. Some parts are harmonious, others proudly out of tune. And behind vocals that declare "This planet is not my home" is not alienation, but a jovial tenacity. The MC5 and the Arkestra got together at the end, for "Starship" and "Outer Spaceways Incorporated," and they redoubled each other's squall, spinning off into free improvisations. Yesterday's protests still made a joyful noise. From babel-list-owner Wed Aug 3 03:18:42 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j73AIegg030233 for ; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 03:18:42 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j73AIeXS030232 for babel-list-obscured; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 03:18:40 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from zproxy.gmail.com (zproxy.gmail.com [64.233.162.207]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j73AIdSq030226 for ; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 03:18:39 -0700 Received: by zproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so56105nzk for ; Wed, 03 Aug 2005 03:18:34 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=INedC7/Q8jsTPIZ5z7KbfPf4LzXvI0AzYGMbY7wJ+6ddfAs8yhgE42Izlxrb/K1mf9EzoIUa4By3C1fUaOsTVMP56cG6/p6946uujPYPMYDyRJrRtGYk6n6DClgI1rSifwROkenGw7v1qT0FIKHVPojd9MngpEWNgnVMdcB4grA= Received: by 10.36.135.2 with SMTP id i2mr218374nzd; Wed, 03 Aug 2005 03:18:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.36.105.8 with HTTP; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 03:18:34 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 11:18:34 +0100 From: Andrew F Wilson To: babel-list Subject: John Cale on WNYC Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by penguin.postmodern.com id j73AIdSq030228 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ There is an interview with John Cale on WNYC today (2.00 pm, New York time, I think). I don't suppose he'll mention Patti, but it may be interesting. I think you can listen from their website. http://www.wnyc.org/shows/soundcheck/episodes/08032005? kind regards Andrew From babel-list-owner Wed Aug 3 14:50:04 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j73Lo4qb017721 for ; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 14:50:04 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j73Lo4Yh017720 for babel-list-obscured; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 14:50:04 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from imo-m27.mx.aol.com (imo-m27.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.8]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j73Lo2la017714 for ; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 14:50:03 -0700 Received: from Aphinar by imo-m27.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id m.158.55fa25d0 (3850) for ; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 17:49:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Aphinar Message-ID: <158.55fa25d0.302295fe> Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 17:49:50 EDT Subject: re: Patti mention in Rolling Stone magazine To: babel-list (Babel-list) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 X-Spam-Flag: NO Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ In a message dated 2005-08-02 8:51:31 PM Eastern Daylight Time, kaj22 writes: > The text is as follows: Patti's Prize. France decided to make an exception > to its policy of hating every American If Rolling Stone really said that, then shame on them. It's ignorant beyond belief. Jay Dillon Jay Dillon Rare Books + Manuscripts From babel-list-owner Wed Aug 3 20:42:43 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j743gfYI026356 for ; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 20:42:43 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j743gfgw026355 for babel-list-obscured; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 20:42:41 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from pop-altamira.atl.sa.earthlink.net (pop-altamira.atl.sa.earthlink.net [207.69.195.62]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j743gefL026349 for ; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 20:42:40 -0700 Received: from wamui-rubis.atl.sa.earthlink.net ([209.86.224.47]) by pop-altamira.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #10) id 1E0Wcx-00066n-00; Wed, 03 Aug 2005 23:42:39 -0400 Message-ID: <5336138.1123126959023.JavaMail.root> Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 21:42:39 -0600 (GMT-06:00) From: Keith Reply-To: Keith To: babel-list, sorell, mgilbert, craighern Subject: Patti/Gang of 4 kinda mash up Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Earthlink Zoo Mail 1.0 Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ here's a link to a not-quite mash-up w/Patti & Gang of Four (I think it's more of a remix w/some of Patti's vocals added, but it's pretty good...it's about halfway down): http://www.boojiboyjnr.com/downloads.htm Keith From babel-list-owner Wed Aug 3 23:45:40 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j746jeTv030095 for ; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 23:45:40 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j746jeNj030094 for babel-list-obscured; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 23:45:40 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from imo-m18.mx.aol.com (imo-m18.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.208]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j746jcaU030088 for ; Wed, 3 Aug 2005 23:45:39 -0700 Received: from Poemsl1 by imo-m18.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id m.ae.778a5bc9 (3866); Thu, 4 Aug 2005 02:45:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Poemsl1 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 02:45:29 EDT Subject: Patti in NY today To: babel-list, eternalcafe MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5200 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Is anyone going to see Patti in Central Park today (Thursday) in NY? Right now, at 2 AM in NYC it's 82 degrees Fahrenheit! It's supposed to be 95 tom'w! I just went out on my terrace and it was HOT. I just don't know if I can sit there in the heat, even to see Patti! I'd like to hear what others are thinking about this. I did see her fairly recently at CBGB's, so I did get a pretty good "Patti fix", but still..... Anyone definitely going? Just curious. xxo- Seena From babel-list-owner Thu Aug 4 05:32:03 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74CW3Te005581 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 05:32:03 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j74CW3Ti005580 for babel-list-obscured; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 05:32:03 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from imo-m18.mx.aol.com (imo-m18.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.208]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74CW1YW005574 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 05:32:01 -0700 Received: from Lloyd5009 by imo-m18.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id m.141.4ac50b09 (48552) for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 08:31:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Lloyd5009 Message-ID: <141.4ac50b09.302364ba> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 08:31:54 EDT Subject: RE: Patti in NY To: Babel-list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5200 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ I am very likely to go but in a leisurely way, that is not going for the opening show and maybe (gasp) not staying for the whole show. It will depend on how crowded it is and whether I actually get myself to the store to buy some bottled water to freeze by tonite! Lisa From babel-list-owner Thu Aug 4 05:55:58 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74CtwEX006051 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 05:55:58 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j74CtvQ1006050 for babel-list-obscured; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 05:55:57 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from ibixmailb.ibi.com (ibixmailb.ibi.com [64.74.32.55]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with SMTP id j74CtuVm006044 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 05:55:56 -0700 Received: from (172.30.176.87) by ibixmailb.ibi.com via smtp id 1fbc_dd8cbc80_04e6_11da_97a4_001143de54cd; Thu, 04 Aug 2005 08:54:16 -0400 Received: from ukexchange.ibi.com ([192.168.12.13]) by ibiexchd.ibi.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Thu, 4 Aug 2005 08:56:39 -0400 Received: From UKEXCHANGE.IBI.COM (192.168.12.13[192.168.12.13 port:1099]) by ukexchange.ibi.com Mail essentials (server 2.422) with SMTP id: <5797> for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 13:41:41 +0100 smtpmailfrom Received: by ukexchange.ibi with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 13:41:41 +0100 Message-ID: From: "Zuliani, Walt" To: "'babel-list'" Subject: Meltdown pictures Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 13:41:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Aug 2005 12:56:39.0971 (UTC) FILETIME=[F4B20730:01C598F3] X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Here's a few Meltdown pictures. http://homepage.mac.com/wzuliani/PhotoAlbum28.html -Walt This e-mail is confidential. If you have received it by mistake, please let us know and then delete it from your system; you should not copy, disclose, or distribute its contents to anyone nor act in reliance on this e-mail, as this is prohibited and may be unlawful. Internet communications are not secure and therefore Information Builders does not accept legal responsibility for the contents of this message. Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Information Builders. From babel-list-owner Thu Aug 4 06:57:22 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74DvLVv007765 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 06:57:22 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j74DvLlH007764 for babel-list-obscured; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 06:57:21 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from imo-m14.mx.aol.com (imo-m14.mx.aol.com [64.12.138.204]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74DvJJc007758 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 06:57:20 -0700 Received: from Aphinar by imo-m14.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id m.127.618dec05 (2519); Thu, 4 Aug 2005 09:57:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Aphinar Message-ID: <127.618dec05.302378b5> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 09:57:09 EDT Subject: re: Patti in NY To: babel-list (Babel-list) CC: Lloyd5009 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 X-Spam-Flag: NO Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ In a message dated 2005-08-04 8:33:13 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Lloyd5009 writes: > I am very likely to go but in a leisurely way, that is not going for the > opening show and maybe (gasp) not staying for the whole show. It will > depend > on how crowded it is and whether I actually get myself to the store to buy > some bottled water to freeze by tonite! Alas, bottles are not permitted at SummerStage. See http://www.summerstage.org/index.aspx?lobid=854 Jay Dillon Jay Dillon Rare Books + Manuscripts From babel-list-owner Thu Aug 4 07:32:53 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74EWrjh008707 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 07:32:53 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j74EWrss008706 for babel-list-obscured; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 07:32:53 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from web53306.mail.yahoo.com (web53306.mail.yahoo.com [206.190.49.96]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with SMTP id j74EWoXe008700 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 07:32:51 -0700 Received: (qmail 35729 invoked by uid 60001); 4 Aug 2005 14:32:46 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=gmNt+5k0TjjL+McE1drIM/jJaytWlqeDE3kUH6pu21RMV83hG+Eg1SeIBoLcHJpGRdPev8zYkQp0tKMlDO27KN63/AYYX8aidGdnRhDNMcq7oJOWwnGeEqoPzJp8mY2Sgwstu/mJDKSi2BcKbZl3+mhGJnxoy3o1ZJJ/x87Kn3Y= ; Message-ID: <20050804143246.35727.qmail> Received: from [208.226.5.250] by web53306.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 04 Aug 2005 07:32:46 PDT Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 07:32:46 -0700 (PDT) From: fm Subject: Re: Patti in NY today To: babel-list, eternalcafe In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Pretty sure my girlfriend and I are going. I half-expect that the weather will keep attendance down. Went to see the MC5/DKT with Sun Ra on Saturday. It was a prefect day, not too hot and there was plenty of elbow room. I've already got water in freezer. Remember - keep those bottles sealed or they won't let them in. Very strict about that. Fernando --- Poemsl1 wrote: > Is anyone going to see Patti in Central Park today > (Thursday) in NY? Right > now, at 2 AM in NYC it's 82 degrees Fahrenheit! It's > supposed to be 95 tom'w! > I just went out on my terrace and it was HOT. I > just don't know if I can > sit there in the heat, even to see Patti! I'd like > to hear what others are > thinking about this. I did see her fairly recently > at CBGB's, so I did get a > pretty good "Patti fix", but still..... Anyone > definitely going? Just curious. > xxo- Seena > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From babel-list-owner Thu Aug 4 08:19:11 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74FJB2S009804 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 08:19:11 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j74FJ6GJ009798 for babel-list-obscured; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 08:19:06 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from sccrmhc14.comcast.net (sccrmhc14.comcast.net [204.127.202.59]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74FJ4NT009790 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 08:19:05 -0700 Received: from hppav (c-67-183-11-251.hsd1.wa.comcast.net[67.183.11.251]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc14) with SMTP id <2005080415190001400d3i14e>; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 15:19:00 +0000 Message-ID: <001101c59908$104d0bc0$fb0bb743> From: "PageRox" To: , References: <20050804143246.35727.qmail> Subject: Re: Patti in NY today Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 08:20:35 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Oh, you lucky NYers!!! The most I get to see Patti is every album tour, and occasinally a surprise outdoor show--2001 was the last before Trampin'--the last time she came thru here! Much less the double bill you saw, Fernando! How wonderful to have these shows! I hope you had fun, and of course want the full report! :-D XO-Glenna ----- Original Message ----- From: fm To: babel-list ; eternalcafe Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 7:32 AM Subject: Re: Patti in NY today Pretty sure my girlfriend and I are going. I half-expect that the weather will keep attendance down. Went to see the MC5/DKT with Sun Ra on Saturday. It was a prefect day, not too hot and there was plenty of elbow room. I've already got water in freezer. Remember - keep those bottles sealed or they won't let them in. Very strict about that. Fernando --- Poemsl1 wrote: > Is anyone going to see Patti in Central Park today > (Thursday) in NY? Right > now, at 2 AM in NYC it's 82 degrees Fahrenheit! It's > supposed to be 95 tom'w! > I just went out on my terrace and it was HOT. I > just don't know if I can > sit there in the heat, even to see Patti! I'd like > to hear what others are > thinking about this. I did see her fairly recently > at CBGB's, so I did get a > pretty good "Patti fix", but still..... Anyone > definitely going? Just curious. > xxo- Seena > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.9/62 - Release Date: 8/2/2005 From babel-list-owner Thu Aug 4 11:17:07 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74IH6BF014608 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:17:07 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j74IH6B3014607 for babel-list-obscured; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:17:06 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from sccrmhc14.comcast.net (sccrmhc14.comcast.net [63.240.76.49]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74IH4N9014600 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:17:05 -0700 Received: from hppav (c-67-183-11-251.hsd1.wa.comcast.net[67.183.11.251]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc14) with SMTP id <2005080418170101400d3a6re>; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 18:17:02 +0000 Message-ID: <017f01c59920$ee7e8780$fb0bb743> From: "PageRox" To: "Keith" , , , , References: <5336138.1123126959023.JavaMail.root> Subject: Re: Patti/Gang of 4 kinda mash up Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:18:35 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Keith--smashing!!! Mashing!! Thanks for this--neat-o, maan! :-D Good to see you again, too! How ya doin' these days?! XO-Glenna ----- Original Message ----- From: Keith To: babel-list ; sorell ; mgilbert ; craighern Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 8:42 PM Subject: Patti/Gang of 4 kinda mash up here's a link to a not-quite mash-up w/Patti & Gang of Four (I think it's more of a remix w/some of Patti's vocals added, but it's pretty good...it's about halfway down): http://www.boojiboyjnr.com/downloads.htm Keith -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.9/62 - Release Date: 8/2/2005 From babel-list-owner Thu Aug 4 12:04:28 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74J4RPW015859 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 12:04:28 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j74J4QTL015858 for babel-list-obscured; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 12:04:26 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from imo-d20.mx.aol.com (imo-d20.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.136]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74J4P0C015849 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 12:04:25 -0700 Received: from Poemsl1 by imo-d20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id m.11.4a8a4a2f (4418); Thu, 4 Aug 2005 15:04:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Poemsl1 Message-ID: <11.4a8a4a2f.3023c0b0> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 15:04:16 EDT Subject: Re: Patti in NY To: Lloyd5009, babel-list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5200 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Have a great time, Lisa! I don't think I'm going to make it! xxo- Seena From babel-list-owner Thu Aug 4 12:09:38 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74J9bDJ016073 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 12:09:38 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j74J9bni016071 for babel-list-obscured; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 12:09:37 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from imo-m20.mx.aol.com (imo-m20.mx.aol.com [64.12.137.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74J9Zs7016063 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 12:09:36 -0700 Received: from Lloyd5009 by imo-m20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id m.105.664742a0 (4459) for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 15:09:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Lloyd5009 Message-ID: <105.664742a0.3023c1d2> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 15:09:06 EDT Subject: Patti in NY To: Babel-list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5200 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ It's mad thundering with showers right now so...who knows. Lisa From babel-list-owner Thu Aug 4 13:07:01 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74K6xnd017391 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 13:07:01 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j74K6xaE017390 for babel-list-obscured; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 13:06:59 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from imo-d20.mx.aol.com (imo-d20.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.136]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74K6tG4017379 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 13:06:58 -0700 Received: from Poemsl1 by imo-d20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id m.19c.38bf4295 (4418); Thu, 4 Aug 2005 16:06:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Poemsl1 Message-ID: <19c.38bf4295.3023cf50> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 16:06:40 EDT Subject: Re: Patti in NY To: Lloyd5009, babel-list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5200 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ I hear ya.... I just looked outside and it didn't look too good. Hope you make it if you things let up! xxo- Seena From babel-list-owner Thu Aug 4 14:46:34 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74LkYQB019117 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 14:46:34 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j74LkYB2019116 for babel-list-obscured; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 14:46:34 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.183]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j74LkVoV019111 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2005 14:46:33 -0700 Received: from host81-154-209-120.range81-154.btcentralplus.com [81.154.209.120] (helo=plc) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0ML21M-1E0nXq2VWO-0000pk; Thu, 04 Aug 2005 23:46:30 +0200 To: "babel-list" Subject: Re: Meltdown pictures References: Message-ID: Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 22:46:35 +0100 From: "Words 2 - Permuted" Organization: Everything is Permuted Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Opera M2/8.02 (Win32, build 7680) X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse login:57deaf623c5ebec18d80bb77a7429aae Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ On Thu, 04 Aug 2005 13:41:36 +0100, Zuliani, Walt permuted the following: > Here's a few Meltdown pictures. > http://homepage.mac.com/wzuliani/PhotoAlbum28.html > > > > -Walt Thanks for posting these. Always had a soft spot for Patti in b/w. And what a fantastic event! -- Words Everything is Permuted http://www.permuted.org.uk/meltdown http://my.opera.com/Words/journal/ http://www.permuted.org.uk/picofday.html - a daily photograph From babel-list-owner Fri Aug 5 07:03:04 2005 Received: from penguin.postmodern.com (penguin.postmodern.com [127.0.0.1]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j75E34G4008015 for ; Fri, 5 Aug 2005 07:03:04 -0700 Received: (from majordom) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j75E33OV008014 for babel-list-obscured; Fri, 5 Aug 2005 07:03:03 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: penguin.postmodern.com: majordom set sender to owner-babel-list using -f Received: from imo-d23.mx.aol.com (imo-d23.mx.aol.com [205.188.139.137]) by penguin.postmodern.com (8.12.11/mcb2004-04-16-SBL-and-CBL) with ESMTP id j75E328V008007 for ; Fri, 5 Aug 2005 07:03:03 -0700 Received: from Lloyd5009 by imo-d23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v38_r4.1.) id m.1a4.3c873e33 (4402) for ; Fri, 5 Aug 2005 10:02:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Lloyd5009 Message-ID: <1a4.3c873e33.3024cb89> Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 10:02:49 EDT Subject: Summerstage August 4, 2005 To: Babel-list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5200 X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01a X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-babel-list Precedence: bulk X-List-Processor: Majordomo 1.94.5 X-List-Archive-Location: http://www.postmodern.com/~babel/ Set list by first line: I was down in Georgia... Oh, to be.... Down in Vineland... Once upon a time you